On The Nation: Lisa Owen interviews Justin Lester

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Incoming Wellington mayor Justin Lester says he wants his Council to be more transparent than the previous one, and promised to release any documents relating to the Singapore Airlines deal.

Mayor Lester says he has a great relationship with all the existing councillors, despite descriptions of the previous Council as toxic.

Lisa Owen: Welcome back. Over the past year, Wellington City Council has been described as toxic, even by its own councillors and staff. Almost all those councillors have now been re-elected, but there is a new mayor, Justin Lester, and he joins me now from Wellington. Good morning and congratulations.
Justin Lester: Thank you, Lisa, and good morning.
Well, the fact is you do have a lot of these councillors who were on the council that were described as toxic. I'm wondering how are you going to turn that around — the infighting and the disagreement?
Well, it's a clean slate, for a start. I'm a new mayor. I've got great relationships with the existing councillors and know all of the incoming councillors too. We've got five new councillors here in Wellington. I think they'll be really positive and will bring a lot of energy and fresh ideas into council.
But you've still got the councillors that were on the so-called toxic council.
We've got five out and five in. And you know what, I think the 'toxic council' thing is a little bit overblown. 95% of our decisions were unanimous on council. Sure, it's a robust contest of ideas — that's what democracy is about — but, personally, I get on with all the councillors really well, and I think that I've shown over the last six years that I can lead the council and will do that as mayor.
Is appointing Paul Eagle as your deputy part of smoothing the way?
Absolutely. I mean, Paul's one of the most experienced and capable councillors, and he'll do a good job. So I think between me and Paul we'll lead a council. We'll be able to get everyone's support around the table on most issues. We'll have robust debates still, but we'll make sure it's positive and in the best interests of Wellington.
Now, one of the things that you said when you were elected was that your first official call will be to the Beehive. Do you think they are going to pick up? Because you've said that that relationship has been really badly damaged.
No, I've never said it's been badly damaged. I think I've got a really good relationship with everybody in central government, and I'll make sure that continues, and it's an opportunity, again, to wipe the slate clean. I'm quite a different mayor, and I'll be a different mayor from my predecessor, Celia, and I'm looking forward to working with the government.
In what way? What do you think that relationship will look like?
I think it will be focused on the issues and on Wellington. The government and I are aligned in our views. We want what's best for the city. We want what's best for the country. We need a strong capital, and that's why I'll be working together really closely with them.
Okay, well, recently house price figures were released that show house price growth in Wellington is outstripping Auckland now. What was it? 14.3% in the last year. I'm wondering is that a good or a bad thing, do you think?
It's a little bit of both. It's great for those that own their own home, and that's why Wellington is so buoyant at the moment. Having said that, if you don't have a home, it's a serious risk. So that's why I've announced a comprehensive housing policy. I want to focus on that $5000 rates rebate for those building their first home. We want to build up an urban development agency as well and want to make sure that we build more homes, because that's what we need to do — we need more supply. I think local government and central government need to step up.
The thing is you have also said that Wellington's economy is really important to you, and boosting that economy. You've got a double-edged sword there, haven't you? Because part of boosting that economy in a growing economy is people wanting houses and house prices going up.
I completely agree. I completely agree it's a risk. That's why we need to build more houses in advance of people coming to live here as well. The great thing is, while that's a percentage increase, I mean, house prices on average are still $200,000-plus cheaper, more affordable that they are in Auckland. And we've got the highest incomes in the country too. So if you look at that factor between what people earn and what house prices are and what they cost, we're actually doing pretty well here in Wellington comparatively.
Okay. Your council's also been criticised for a lack of transparency. Is that going to change with you as mayor?
Look, we've just signed off our annual report. I think we won the annual report of any sector or organisation three years in a row. We weren't allowed to compete any more, because we kept winning. So I think our transparency's really good. We've been in election campaign, and it's sometimes convenient for people to make suggestions, but, however, our councils are very transparent. I'll make sure it's even more transparent in the future, and I'll change some of those delegations as well to make sure that any large funding decisions come back to council for a final determination.
Okay, because I'm sure ratepayers will be interested in that, because you've been involved in a council committee that did a secret deal with Singapore Airlines, where the council is investing $800,000 a year for a decade to get them to fly into Wellington. So I'm wondering why is there no paperwork on this deal? Are you trying to hide something?
There is paperwork. There's a contract. And just to make very clear, that wasn't a secret committee. That was decided by all of council through our annual plan. We funded $1.9 million a year, reported on in our annual plan and our annual report, and agreed unanimously by all councillors. And then the delegation sat with the Chief Executive to make a final determination. And that's absolutely right. It's important to distinguish between governance and management. And we've got a $460 million budget every year, and it's not my job to then, every little detail, to sit at the desk of the Chief Executive and tell him how to do his job. We set the direction. We make sure that we do set guidelines for the Chief Executive. But at the same time, he has to be able to work.
But the Singapore Airlines paperwork still hasn't been made available for people to scrutinise, for journalists to scrutinise.
Oh, it has. There's been a report and a contract as well. The contract can't be released, because that's a commercial contract with a range of parties. But, again, I'm being very clear. It's an $800,000 investment, approximately.
Yes, but that report is only a couple of pages. It's not all the communication. It's not all what was going on behind closed deals.
I'm happy to release anything that's available to me. And likewise I've said, in the future, I would like those delegations to sit with the council so we’ll have a formal and public report that goes to council. That's the changes that I'll make.
Okay, so you're making an undertaking now that you will make whatever paperwork you have available for scrutiny.
Yes. And I don't have available paperwork myself, because, again, that was a Chief Executive delegation decision. So the Chief Executive has released a report, won't release the contract, but it stands up to scrutiny. And you know what? We've been trying for more than six years to get a long-haul airline into Wellington. We've got one. It's costing us about $800,000 a year, and the economic return to Wellington is about $45 million a year. So I would make the same decision if it came to council, and I suspect it would be unanimous, because it's a great outcome for the city.
But how do we know that? How do we know that if all the information is not on the table?
It's been reported in our annual plan and our annual report. But what I'll do in the future, every future decision will come to council.
Yes, but that's predictions, Mr Lester. That's predictions.
Yes, and that's what I'll do.
All right, well, thank you very much for joining me this morning. Best of luck in the new job.
Thank you. Thanks very much, Lisa.

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