Q+A: Gareth Morgan interviewed by Corin Dann
Q+A: Gareth Morgan interviewed by Corin Dann
Gareth Morgan to give money to
charity in exchange for voter details
Philanthropist turned political party founder
Gareth Morgan is pledging a million dollars of his own money
to charities in exchange for the contact details of
potential voters.
Speaking on TVNZ’s Q+A programme this morning, Mr Morgan told Corin Dann the donations would be made instead of spending on pre-election advertising for The Opportunities Party.
“I sort of put my mind to it and thought, well, maybe – can I get a win-win here? Can I get people to sort of follow the Opportunities Party – at least look at our stuff – but also not just waste the money on billboards?,” he said.
“I put a million dollars into a pot for advertising and every time somebody comes to the website and says, ‘No, we’d rather you spend it on a charity,’ then 3 dollars of that goes across to the charity.”
In exchange, people would be required to leave their contact details to the party.
Mr Morgan created The Opportunities Party earlier this year and the most recent One News Colmar Brunton poll, on Tuesday 6 June, showed the party polling at 1 percent.
Mr Morgan’s
policies include introducing a tax on all capital and to
legalise cannabis.
ENDS
Please find attached the full
transcript of the interview and here’s the Link:
Q+A, 9-10am Sundays on
TVNZ 1 and one hour later on TVNZ 1 + 1.
Repeated Sunday
evening at around 11:35pm. Streamed live at www.tvnz.co.nz
Thanks to the
support from NZ On Air.
Q +
A
Episode
14
GARETH
MORGAN
Interviewed by CORIN
DANN
CORIN Welcome back to Q+A.
After registering in March, the Opportunities Party is now
up to 1.4% in our latest 1 News Colmar Brunton poll and
they’ve got that critical 5% threshold now in their
sights. Leader Gareth Morgan joins me now. Good morning to
you.
GARETH Good
morning, Corin.
CORIN
Let’s start first with this announcement this
morning. You’re going to give away $1 million to charity,
but you want people to choose the charity and therefore
provide you with their email addresses. Is that
correct?
GARETH Yeah.
So, I mean, the reality is that the Nats are going to spend
something north of 5 million on this campaign. Labour will
spend over 3. The government’s just given each of those
teams a million each – taxpayers’ your
money.
CORIN Broadcasting
funding.
GARETH Broadcasting.
And so if we want to compete in that game, we have to spend
that sort of money as well. I mean, that’s just the
reality of politics. I don’t like it, the way we’re
going, but that’s just the reality. So I went home and
said to my wife, ‘Oh, I’m going to have to spend the
million anyway on advertising.’ She wasn’t very happy
with that. ‘Surely you can do something better with the
money.’ So I sort of put my mind to it and thought, well,
maybe – can I get a win-win here? Can I get people to sort
of follow the Opportunities Party – at least look at our
stuff – but also not just waste the money on billboards?
So that’s the idea here. I put $1 million into a pot for
advertising and every time somebody comes to the website and
says, ‘No, we’d rather you spend it on a charity,’
then $3 of that goes across to the
charity.
CORIN But
let’s face it – you’re after their email addresses so
you can directly target
them.
GARETH Totally.
I’ve got to compete. I’m not dodging that at all. I’m
just saying it’s a smarter way to do it than just to waste
taxpayers’ money – or my money, in this case – on
advertising.
CORIN Is
this whole routine of the reluctant politician for real?
GARETH I want
policy change and I want progress, the same as you just saw
in the UK with the under-30s. They want things to change. I
want things to
change.
CORIN You
want policy change but you don’t want to do the hard yards
in parliament. You don’t want to be branded like a normal
politician.
GARETH No,
not a normal politician. You’re dead
right.
CORIN What’s
wrong with
that?
GARETH Nothing.
I’m just saying look at the complacency we’ve had and
the inertia we’ve got in our system. We’re not making
the sort of progress we could make at very little cost –
in fact at a lot of benefit, and that’s what I want to
see. I don’t care which party does it. I just want to push
them.
CORIN But you
seem to be saying you want to come into parliament as some
sort of – I saw somebody, quote, ‘philosopher king’
– reluctant politician, but not actually scrap it out and
fight for your ideas like everyone else
has.
GARETH Well,
I’ve been fighting for my ideas for years. I’ve written
a lot of books. I’ve been on a lot of commissions and all
the rest of
it.
CORIN But all
your messaging to the public is, ‘Oh, I don’t want to be
there.’
GARETH I
don’t want a career, but I’ve got a team of people
around me growing and growing as we talk here who are more
than willing to take up the fight. I’m just the vehicle to
establish this party and get it off the ground and get it
going.
CORIN So do
personalities and your personality – does that matter in
politics?
GARETH Well,
I don’t think it should. I think it should begin and end
with policy. That’s all I’m interested
in.
CORIN But
that’s not realistic, is
it?
GARETH Well, I
think we’ve gone too much the other way where it’s all
about personality and not about enough content. Meanwhile,
people are missing out and I’m trying to address that so
all boats rise
here.
CORIN But is
there anything wrong with somebody who’s had a busy life
who says, ‘You know what? I’m going to vote on the basis
of I like this person. I trust
them,’?
GARETH I
think that basically sums up their perception of what that
person is going to contribute, and all I guess I’m saying
is if it’s all personality and no content, no substance,
Corin, then I think the country just drifts, and that’s
what I think New Zealand is doing. I mean, we’ve got some
real holes in our policy. You know about it with the housing
affordability. I mean, the Nats with their immigration
policy have allowed low-skilled people to come in and
suppress wages, stop trickle-down happening in this country.
Meanwhile, those people on the modest incomes – their
rents are going up. They’re getting gutted. I just think
there’s too many people here being left behind. You cannot
build prosperity on anything apart from a foundation of
fairness. That is what I’m here
for.
CORIN OK. I
won’t labour this point too much, but you’ve talked in
the past about not going into parliament unless you had 10%.
Do you stand by
that?
GARETH I want
a majority, right? I want a mandate, I mean. So to slip in
like Act does, you know, under some gerrymandered scheme –
I mean, that just disgusts me, that kind of
stuff.
CORIN OK,
but say you got 5% -- your party gets 5% -- would you
actually stand and go into
parliament?
GARETH Well,
I think it depends on how the other cards fall. If 5%
actually means you have influence then absolutely. I’d be
in there getting as many of our dozen policies
through.
CORIN So
you would go into parliament at
5%?
GARETH If—No.
It depends on how the cards fall. So, yes, I would go in.
Would I stay there? It depends if I—I am not personally
going to tread water for three years. I’ve got better
things to do with my life, all right? And I’ve got a lot
of people around
me.
CORIN So a lot
of this is going to depend on your other
candidates.
GARETH On
my candidates, that’s right. Geoff’s in there,
obviously.
CORIN Obviously
people will be starting to know Geoff, but who else have you
got lined
up?
GARETH Well, I
mean, we’ve just—Jenny Condie’s come in, so she’s,
you know, a tax PhD. That’s what she does. We’ve got
Lesley Immink from the tourism side come in. We’ve got
quite a few coming in the next couple of weeks. So it’s
building, you
know.
CORIN All
right.
GARETH I’ve
started from zero, remember, here,
Corin.
CORIN Yes.
Let’s say you do get 5% here hypothetically, and you go
in. Who would you prop up? Do you have a
choice?
GARETH No.
Well, I think if you ask—If you take our policies and look
at us on that sort of left-right blimmin’ thing – which
really annoys me – but if you did, you would have to say
on economic matters that I’m actually—we’re quite
dry.
CORIN Closer
to
National?
GARETH Oh,
hell, yeah. I mean, I’m very much in
favour—
CORIN Closer
to Act or in the
middle?
GARETH Not
Act. I mean, Act—Far right and far left, forget them.
I’m not interested in
them.
CORIN OK.
GARETH But
in terms of free and competitive markets, I think they’re
a very powerful weapon to get the
allocation.
CORIN But
you don’t support
TPP?
GARETH No, I
think TPP—The trouble with that is to the extent that it
compromises your public policy, I think it should be shot. I
don’t like that aspect of it. I’m all for free trade,
but I’m not
for—
CORIN Sure.
But what you’re saying is you could support both
sides?
GARETH Totally.
I mean, I get on with both sides. I think in terms of the
social-type stuff I’m probably closer to Labour, but on
the economic stuff I’m closer
to—
CORIN Would
you be the tail wagging the dog? Would you--? What
would--?
GARETH Well,
that’s what MMP
is.
CORIN Yeah, I
know, but if you got your 5%, what would be the one policy
which you would be demanding that you get your
concession?
GARETH Tax
reform.
CORIN So
you’re going to essentially—As a 5% party, you might be
saying to a large chunk of New Zealanders that they will
have to pay a tax for owning their own
home.
GARETH Well,
I’m saying to them that they could get a 30% tax cut,
actually, if you read the whole policy. So it’s all about
changing the base of the tax to make it fair and using those
proceeds to drop the rates. There’s not one dollar in our
stuff of extra tax
for—
CORIN But if
you’re over 65 and you’re not working, not only do you
get the tax on your house but you also get means-tested
under your
policy.
GARETH Yeah,
well, remember the tax on the house there is rolled up into
an estate duty, so there’s no cash flow effect. You
shouldn’t dodge it just because of your
age.
CORIN Sure,
sure. I don’t want to argue the merits of your policy, but
what I’m saying is do you think you can justify demanding
a policy that, I guess, radical with 5% of the
vote?
GARETH Well,
it’s a negotiating situation, isn’t it? So I’d put
that on the table and whoever the government of the day is
will negotiate with us in terms of the transition to that. I
mean, that’s where we end up at the end, but the last
thing I want to do is crash house prices, Corin. You know,
you just can’t do that, so you have to phase this sort of
thing in. But we need to make the tax system fair and
efficient.
CORIN You’ve
said yourself even a government announcing that they might
do your equity tax or your land tax would probably bring
house prices down – just the announcement that it’s
going to
happen.
GARETH Yeah,
so that just tells you that it’s not going to take that
much of a tweak for this to actually occur – for us to get
this house price inflation out of the system, to get capital
in this country properly allocated so we can get higher
growth incomes and particularly get trickle-down to the
people on the lower
incomes.
CORIN What’s
happening with this cannabis policy? Where did this come
from? Why did you suddenly adopt this cannabis
policy?
GARETH Well,
cannabis policy is interesting, because when it first
came—One of the—Geoff, I think it was, put it to me and
I said, ‘You’ve got to joking,’ you know, not, sort
of, knowing anything about it. He said, ‘No, no. Go
through the science of it and let’s do the evidence.’ So
we got the whole evidence base together. You know, it’s
other people’s work. It’s not our work. And I could see
immediately that the issue with cannabis was the prohibition
of that particular drug and the harm that was caused by
prohibition. I saw it face-to-face when I was in Waitangirua
at a meeting there where that community was being
blackmailed by the criminal underworld, having its cannabis
supply withdrawn and told it could only opt for P. Now,
remember, these are not your normal potheads at the
university, right? These are people who are taking drugs to
escape just for one day the misery of their lives. I mean,
this is actually quite serious. So that’s what got me. I
said, ‘Shit, we’ve actually got to deal with this –
with the harm caused by the criminalization of this drug.’
And that’s where the policy came
from.
CORIN So this
wasn’t some attempt by you to find an issue that was going
to suddenly resonate with young people, trying to get you a
profile? Because it certainly—It looks a bit like
that.
GARETH I
mean, I’ve done a lot of polling, and one of the market
research guys said, ‘Well, it’s really cool because your
policies actually appeal to young people, so that’s good
news, Gareth. Now here’s the bad news – they don’t
vote.’ And I went, ‘You’ve got to be joking. How the
hell do we get them in the polls?’ So we did another piece
of research. The number one issue amongst young people –
and this blows me out of the water – in this country is
cannabis law
reform.
CORIN So do
you support direct
democracy?
GARETH I
very much support deliberative democracy where you have a
discussion with the constituency over any issue that
involves values, and then you use your evidence – so you
think, in other words – to come to the right policy to
implement, to
fulfil.
CORIN Do
you actually like the system of democracy? Sometimes it
looks a bit like you feel frustrated that people don’t get
stuff and that you know
best.
GARETH No. I
think what we have is best practice when it comes to policy,
and that’s pretty well-known in the policy community. Then
you look at what the politicians actually do and the
difference is ridiculous and you go, ‘Well, is that
actually just pragmatism or are these guys cynical and
actually playing to their—cherry-picking?’ I mean,
we’ve just seen that with the
National—
CORIN It’s
the art of what’s possible, isn’t
it?
GARETH No.
CORIN Under
an MMP
system.
GARETH No.
I think you can play to a particular constituency by
manipulating policy. We just saw that with the land and
water reform, where the land and water reform group came up
with a set of policies and the Nats cherry-picked it, right,
to suit their own community—their own constituency, so you
end up with a policy that’s incoherent. I don’t like
incoherent policies. I don’t like taxi drivers with big,
loud voices in parliament and no content, all right? I’m
trying to deal to
it.
CORIN Gareth
Morgan, thank you very much for your time. I look forward to
talking to you again on this
campaign.
GARETH Thanks,
Corin.
CORIN Back
to you,
Greg.